Difficult To Love

A good friend emailed this link to me the other day and I wanted to share it with everyone. It reminded me of what the WOS said to me one time after days, probably weeks of refusing to say “I love you” and pulling away if I went to touch him and I finally went to him and knelt in front of him, put my hands on his knees and looked him in the eye and told him I would leave if that is what he wanted but I didn’t know what more I could do, I couldn’t stay where I was this unwanted. His reply to me was,

“It’s not so easy to love someone when they don’t love you back is it?”

That was it, and I was left sitting there wondering what the hell that was supposed to mean. Was I being punished for some other woman who broke his heart? So I started making the plans to leave because I will not ever stay where I am not welcome and then it was me leaving him, it wasn’t his idea. I had misunderstood, was being paranoid, didn’t I know his love was cyclable? I was too needy, too demanding, had expectations and if I didn’t have expectations I wouldn’t get let down.

About every 3 years the WOS would say something profoundly truthful but I didn’t take it for what it obviously said, That he just didn’t love me and never would, I allowed him to mess with my head, play games, push me away, pull me close so he could push me away and make me feel foolish.

If someone truly loves you their love is not cyclable, if someone loves you they do everything within their power to NOT hurt you, not to cause you pain. and if they do hurt you they will do everything within their power to make amends.

Here is the link.

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27 Replies to “Difficult To Love”

  1. Lou, I just bought my domain name for $18 a year. so I don’t have the wordpress at the end of it. Nothing else is different. I just paid for my 2nd year so you are only a year late to notice. LOL If you want to have Adwords you need to be dot.com I am making about $95 a month with wordads, not a lot but it all adds up.

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  2. Hi Carrie,

    Great blog post as always!

    Reading what your Narc said to you kind of upset me. (I try to let any Narc behavior upset me these days, but rather just try to stay away).

    I imagined my Narc saying those words to me and thought of a few different replies. But that’s the frustrating part: Just being in that position you didn’t invite or ask for in the first place.

    There are times I don’t remember, but when I do…something about this saying/ allegory helps me a lot. Because I know it’s true about Narcs.

    It’s the story of the mouse who asked for a ride across the lake from a crocodile. In the story, the crocodile promises that he won’t eat the mouse, but half ways across the lake the crocodile does. And before he is eaten, the mouse asks ‘why?’ and said ‘but- you promised!’ and the crocodile said that it couldn’t help it, that eating the mouse was just in it’s nature.

    Now, this is just a little story, and not true to life of course, but it’s more true to life when applied to experiences with Narcs. They make promises, they say things and then the next day say something totally different. They appear to have no loyalties- only what suits them in the moment.

    And we ask ‘why?’ and we say ‘but- you promised!’. Really, it is in their nature. It has nothing to do with us, how pretty we are or nice, or lovable. Betrayal, selfishness, lying….it is their nature.

    I have to remind myself of that sometimes. Like that tiger that mauled either Siegfried or Roy. It was a good tiger for years, but then one day, it acted like a tiger. My Narc, …I could look for signed of change, try to set the perfect scenario and mood, and my Narc will behave like a Narc. Maybe not today, but most likely the next day…it’s inevitable. You would have to not have feelings, needs, wants or dreams in order to be happy with a Narc, and that’s just not normal, human- seeming, or the way I’d like to live my life.

    Just my thoughts.

    Hang in there 🙂

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    1. AnnStacy, i have heard that saying before and it fits the narcissist perfectly. Thanks for sharing. It is the truth. It is hard to not take the abuse personally when you are the one being destroyed but it really has nothing to do with the victim, its just the way the narcissist is, he can’t help it (not that he wants to) He is handicapped, just like an amputee can’t grow another limb, a narcissist can’t grow a soul.

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  3. Hi Carrie,

    It isn’t easy. I have trouble at least a few times a week. I feel a little ache of sadness. It’s difficult because I think I still internally wonder why I had to be in a position like this, ; why such a position even exists. I remember the allegory, but I think I mourn for the love and security in a husband that I always kind of expected was automatic once you married someone. Instead, I have to stay away from him because he regularly and consistently gains satisfaction, and relief from his own discomfort by being hurtful to other people.

    Hang in there. I think you’re doing great. You blog helps a lot of people and I’m grateful for it. Have a great day today!

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    1. AnnStacy, thank you I am glad I am of help to you and others. I understand you wondering why you were in that position, it is hard to not take it personally when someone would want to hurt you like that, we are normal people who would never think of doing that to someone. If we did, we would have to hate them so badly we can’t even imagine it because we have never hated anyone that bad even the narcissist. normal people break up with someone they don’t like they don’t go on a mission to destroy them.
      It is just the way the N works. The reason you were the “chosen” one varies as to what you had to offer and what he needed at the time. i am sure looking back you can see what the N wanted from you. But the next N might want something totally different so you never know. James always went for looks but this last woman isn’t good looking and it kinda surprised me but when he told me about he the first thing he said to me was, she is a widow and all of a sudden he was semi retired.
      In order to get over your ex and ever date with confidence you have to establish boundaries and still to them. The N counts on pushing our boundaries and if we give in to anything he knows he has us. Once we compromise on one boundary he starts working on the other ones. The first time he is just testing, it will be something small but you probably noticed he kept upping the anti, that is because the more we give away the more committed we become because we are giving up our principles for him and that is what he counts on. So if there is a reason you were in the position that you were it is because you compromised your values and boundaries.
      Hugs
      Carrie

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      1. I agree Carrie.

        It was all so foreign to me. He was constantly testing my boundaries. I was at a loss because I couldn’t understand why anyone would present themselves one way, and then do a complete 180 over time. Why the dishonesty, constant chaos?

        However, I did compromise my boundaries, in ways I felt, in the beginning were uncomfortable yet small, until over time, I was just exhausted, drained….you know.

        I definitely will be wary in the future. You’re told that relationships are about compromise. But the Narc asks for compromise of your feelings and integrity so…those aren’t things I believe we’re supposed to compromise.

        I agree that they are constantly looking for aspects in other people to use and benefit from. It’s one of the reasons I don’t miss my Narc. I miss having a nice partner, and hoped that that would be automatic with my Narc- but what I miss is more of what I long for, and that’s not him.

        However, I never missed my Narc or feel that I wonder what he’s doing with anyone else, because they do the same things with everyone else that they did with us: they see the people in their lives as objects, not as people. They don’t care about other’s feelings, unless they’re using that information to manipulate, and they’re planning their next boundary pushing, hurtful, outrageous action.

        So, in a way, being without them is better than being with them. When they are not with us, we have the same amount of emotional closeness as we did with them as when they were in our lives, and a lot less of the emotional abuse.

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  4. Problem with that theory is the little mouse knew it was dealing w. a croc. Most of us here had no idea what an N was, until after most the damage was done. There are some that go on and deal knowingly with the N, perhaps even believe their lies AFTER they are fully aware of what they are, those victims I believe are lying to themselves more than the N is lying to them at that point. It’s a sad state of affairs really. I do not buy the N is just doing what comes to him naturally, I can’t. I know the lying is compulsive, the need to win is ever present and there is an overwhelming need to hurt. To say “it is just the way he is” and accept it , in a way is making excuses for him/ her’s bad behavior. They don’t need nor want our excuses. I think they are proud to be what they are, think they are superior. I believe they have a choice, at some point. It may be something they have little control over but they DO have a choice. They can choose to not hurt ppl. They can chose to just walk away AFTER they are done with a victim. But they don’t. They have to turn the knife, make an innocent person PAY for loving them. There is no excuse anyone can make for that. THAT is a choice.

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    1. Ellie, I thought the same as you at first but when you think about it, it is excusing the N, it is stating a fact. The N does not have a “good side” to say that he has a choice whether he hurts someone or not gives the illusion that if he has the ability to change and he doesn’t.
      He has no conscience, no empathy, yes he knows what he is doing but he doesn’t care and never will care. Yes the mouse knew the crocodile might eat him and he was stupid to trust the crocodile. I was the mouse at one point, I had been used and abused my James and I still trusted him because I lied to myself. I should have known that he had lied before and been sorry before and not listened to his lies but I wanted it so badly I lied to myself.So I was stupid, but I still didn’t know at that time that he could never change. I never thought he would try to destroy me after we broke up, I didn’t realize that is a N trait until very recently. I thought he was just bleeding me dry because he wanted money and things, I thought he wanted my truck, I thought he was jealous I did better at hauling scrap than he did, I had no idea that they destroy someone for the sheer pleasure of destroying the person. Yes that is a choice on his part but it is so part of his nature, obviously because they all do it I dont think he really has much choice. In his mind it is necessary, he can’t walk away until he destroys her, Until she is destroyed he has not won, and he can not lose, it kills him, his ego can’t handle it. It is like death to him for her to move on and be happy.

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      1. I agree with what you wrote Carrie.

        Ellie, I think of it much like – it’s backward for them than for a normal person.

        We have a choice. We can be on a sidewalk and someone can be walking slowly in front of us and we have choices. A normal person, would go around them, or say excuse me to get the person’s attention, or they could walk slower. These choices would feel good to normal for a normal person. However, we also have the option of shoving that person out of the way, and maybe even yelling at them.

        A normal person wouldn’t choose the pushing and yelling option because, in addition to poor etiquette- doing so would probably make us feel like lousy people afterward, which would be an negative emotional feeling. That is our conscience, and helps us guide our lives in lots of situations.

        A Narc, I think, is 180 degrees apart, or totally opposite. In the scenario above, the Narc would feel emotionally bad waiting, being polite (which Narcs believe is average, and average is not how they see themselves, because they see themselves as superior and therefore entitled). So, to do the polite thing, a Narc feels emotionally bad. A Narc pushing and yelling at the person in the way feels normal or good because it reinforces their idea about themselves- in other words entitled, superior, and able to get their way at the expense of someone else.

        The only time, they would feel badly about pushing and yelling is if someone they wanted to impress saw this and it caused them to be taken out of a position to manipulate the person they wanted to impress. But instead of blaming themselves, they would blame the person they pushed or some other person for causing them to be caught/ seen by the other person, or blame the person they pushed for reacting negatively thereby drawing the other persons attention.

        Narcs cannot stand being ‘average’. Average people wait in line and follow the rules. Superior people, which they consider themselves, are better than everyone else and entitled to do whatever they want. To tell them to do anything other than what they want to do, and agree with them, seems in their mind, akin to telling them they aren’t great. They don’t want to be like everyone else.

        I have had a few Narc female friends in my life (I keep my distance now), and the way they treated waiters, sales people, etc was horrible. Any chance to exploit someone’s kindness- they took it. They almost hurt people, lie, frustrate and manipulate as often as a normal person silently reassures themselves throughout the day that they did the right thing in their actions with others.

        A normal persons conscience considers other’s feelings. A Narc’s lack of conscience needs just as much confirmation that they are one upping, in control, and demonstrating superiority to other people.

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      2. AnnStacy, many people are confused about what is a psychopath, sociopath, antisocial or narcissist personality disorder because the DSM keeps changing.
        It used to be sociopath was the term used to describe these people, then they decided that psychopaths were born that way and sociopaths were made that way by their upbringing. THEN they decided they were all psychopaths and upbringing influenced how they functioned in society but they were all born with the disorder. they were all narcissistic. So now they have changed it again and come up with a new title Antisocial Personality Disorder and put the term psychopath, sociopath and narcissist all under the same heading of Antisocial PD. There aren’t 4 different pd, they just keep changing the name they call them. They are all the same! It is confusing for people. If I explained it clearly. REcap, they have reclassified personality disorders and now psychopath, sociopaths and narcissists are all under the heading of Antisocial personality disorder. Hope that cleared things up for you.

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        1. And just to reiterate……………….. NONE can be cured. No matter what you call them they are evil w/ no hope of ever being other than they are. Nothing can get past the No empathy factor. Either the neurons , the nerve path is there or it just isn’t.

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          1. I’m 99% there with that one. I believe that they can’t be cured, but every now and then there’s a twinge of hope, or I momentarily forget.

            Either way, it’s ok, because I’ve been so traumatized and burned by my Narc that it’s second nature to stay away. I might fantasize about us doing something together, but my mind has to jump over so many mental hurdles to find a path on which any scenario of our spending time together wouldn’t turn out to be a nightmare or potentially physically dangerous- I just give up.

            It’s sad. But, I count my blessings because I’m not in denial. I know that there are women who have been in my position that haven’t made it out of the relationship alive. Our lives are not worth chancing over a very slim chance that ‘maybe things will be “different”. I’m choosing to stay rational.

            Sometimes I wish that a loving partner wasn’t so deeply ingrained in me as something to want. It surprises me sometimes how long and how deeply the wanting of it has consumed a lot of my quiet, alone time.

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            1. Oh Ann 😦 It’s that 1% that will get you eventually. That coupled with the wanting of a partner. Right now it appears you are scared of him which is a good thing. But he could pretend to change. He could tell you everything you have prayed to hear. He could tell you GOD has worked a miracle. The one percent will kick in. WE want to believe , we really do. It is in our nature. They know that. They know what to say when to say it, how to say it. Pray to stay strong. If it happens it will all be a lie.

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  5. Hi Ellie,

    I agree with what you’re saying. I guess, to clarify, I think that although they can choose to do the right thing- it seems like they feel better inside themselves hurting people- that it pains them to walk the straight and narrow and be honest and good to people.

    So why, it sounds like an excuse, for all intents and purposes, chastising them, and trying to correct them doesn’t work. I kind of think it’s a spiritual problem as well. Secularly, NPD/ Psychopathy can be seen as a mental disorder, but these people are choosing to do the wrong thing.

    For me, until my Narc is a truly reformed, Saved (Christian) individual, that actually feels bad to lie and hurt people and feels good dealing honestly with others, I have to stay away from him- because they way I explain it in shorthand to myself, is that right now- hurting people and lying to them is in his nature.

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    1. Hey Ann,

      NPD is not a mental illness, mental illness can be cured, treated. Individuals can take medication, go to therapy and perhaps make some progress. The mentally ill has empathy. Not NPD. Research has been done their brains are different and until they can perform brain transplants ( lol , and then they would not be them ) there is no hope. Yes, GOD can perform miracles, and I guess if he wanted to he could actually make the N’s repent, but, until the day HE chooses to do that, and I have never seen one genuine case where he has, it is better to accept the fact that they will never regret anything, ever. There are plenty of them that pretend to be religious, to be saved as a form of manipulation to trick you into thinking they have changed, another part of the game for them. My point was, since N’s even though they can not feel empathy, they KNOW what the right thing to do is. The moral thing, since very young ages , they observe ppl to learn how to act normal. They are intelligent , they read. They KNOW, even if they can’t feel the emotion that goes with it. They could. when done using a person, after the act is over and the mask cracks, just choose to walk away, that would be tough enough. But most of them go on to destroy obliterate the person they have disgarded. Even though they KNOW without a doubt it is wrong.

      If you are praying for a miracle, let that miracle be for yourself 🙂 That you have the strength to move on and not wait for him to change because he can’t and won’t EVER.

      Hugs,
      Ellie

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      1. Thanks Ellie,

        I do pray for that- the strength to move on.

        It would be a miracle for him to change, but I’ve gotten to the point where, he’s so off the wall- his Narc behavior even cost him a job because he kept asking for raises every three months and making passive aggressive threats to his employers (a bone head, yet somehow purely Narc mood…baffling to witness)
        I don’t pray for him to change for us to be together anymore. Because despite how sad thinking about what I experienced with him can be- I know it’s not him I miss. -That I long for genuine loving, respectful treatment in a relationship.

        I pray for him to change from afar because I believe Hell exists. The Bible said that in these times that “men would be lovers of themselves”. My Narc even said more than a few times that he was ‘a god’. Initially, I thought he was just joking around. Over time, my Narc was so confident that anything he wanted to do was ok, he had been arrested, thrown out of a company party by the security hosting the event, and eventually fired a few months after we separated.

        I believe that addition to being some kind of mental/ condition that may also have been caused by his upbringing, that Narcissism is also a spiritual condition. So that is why I pray.

        From my, and other’s perspective,my Narc is a lot of things. An acquaintance of his called him (edited) F’d up. And a family member of his said, unprovoked- yet seriously, that my Narc was a piece of (edited) S—.

        He ruins every relationship he has, uses people, and ruins his own life. There were many moments where I sensed a pure goodness in him, which I’m sure you can relate to, because we wouldn’t have gotten involved with these people if we didn’t sense on some level that they were good somewhere, on some level.

        Yet, it’s like a lovable rabid dog. When they’re not trying to maul you, you van remember the good times when you petted them and they were calm. It’s not worth it, you have to stay away.

        Away from him, over time, I’m still healing, yet, I have enough distance from the situation to want him to be better. The Bible clearly says people who do the things he does will be destroyed, and that also a lot of people “perish for lack of knowledge”. Why ever he is the way he is, I pray that he is has a chance to repent and be Saved and changed and serve The Lord genuinely.

        Carrie, I have given thought to fallen angels and that they have no chance to be Saved. Of course, I don’t know, but hope that before My Narc dies, that he has a chance to turn it around.

        It’s a terrible situation. These are extraordinary times. My Christian faith and by reading The Bible, I know that it says that rain falls on the just and the unjust. This is just part of our own personal troubles. We just have to keep the Faith, do what’s right, and hang in there.

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    2. AnnStacy, your statement scares me because it sounds like you think it is possible for a narcissist to repent and be saved. i have never heard of one, not one in the 3+ years i have had this blog and i have done a lot of research; who has seen the light and changed.
      I have heard of some that professed to be changed, James did it a couple of times and boy did he ever talk the talk. He admitted to everything, cried, apologized for everything and didn’t blame me or anyone else, he owned it. I thought he MUST have changed. We had no contact for 3+ months, he called me, he confessed and admitted to all the wrong doing, he told me all the areas he knew he had to change,. Why would he bother, why would he put himself out there like that if he didn’t mean it?Because he hadn’t destroyed me and he came back to do the job right. Because he is a narcissistic asshole that gets off on destroying people.
      He may be a different person in his next life but it is not going to happen in this lifetime and if you think there is a hope, that if you pray hard enough God will perform a miracle you are in for a very painful awakening. I prayed for years, I believed with all my heart that God wanted him and I to be together and I believed God could perform the miracle of saving James. God saved me! God has helped me get back on my feet and there was a purpose to me meeting James, there was a lesson in it for me and I learned it and I am using it to help others and I am content with that. I am at peace with it and I enjoy my life without james. Do I wish it would have ended differently, OMG YES!! I wish I could have ridden off in the magical carriage with my prince but that was not God’s plan. god is only so powerful.
      If we go back to the Bible, who is the devil? but an ex angel? if God had the power to change some evil into someone good why would he not have done it with the devil? I think N’s sold their soul to the devil at some point, not that they even know it because they gave their soul away. There is evil all around the world and I bet they are all narcissists and psychopaths, and they think THEY are God. For them to want to change is an impossibility.

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        1. Ann,

          You commented:
          “I believe that addition to being some kind of mental/ condition that may also have been caused by his upbringing, that Narcissism is also a spiritual condition. So that is why I pray.”

          Part of the healing process is accepting Narcissism for what it is, it is a PD. It isn’t a mental illness. It isn’t a spiritual crisis. They are their own God! They answer to no one. Not even the man upstairs 😦 To be saved you must do so of your own free will, you must want to be saved! You must accept that God can take all your sins and imperfections and forgive you for them and grant you eternal life. Major problem with this is that the N does not see themselves EVER as “imperfect”. No matter what happens. They do not sin, not in their minds. They can’t. They can do whatever they want to whoever they want,, including murder, and they feel nothing, are not repentent. They are not having an “internal crisis”. In order to do so you have to be conflicted, have warring emotions. Since they do not have any empathy, can not develop it since the neurons needed are missing, they can only pretend for a while, mimic what they have seen in others. They say the words needed to get them what they want. Upbringing may make Narcissism “show” sooner, is all. Those with a loving upbringing learn what “normal ” ppl’s emotions are and can go into society “pretending” to be normal. A very strict abusive childhood probably “shows” Narc traits sooner and stronger as they have not had anything “good” to mimic.

          Do you pray for Satan or do you ask to be protected from Satan? They are some that are “lost” even the the almighty. Satan is the Ultimate Deciever and so are N’s.

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          1. I hear what you’re saying.

            It’s extremely sad/ troublesome to me, because that means that there are many people who are lost to GOD even while alive.

            I’ve done all I can really do to help my N. I sent him a Bible and some links to information, yet it’s ultimately up to him to change if possible. Either way, I have to stay away from him.

            It’s a very sad condition, however, I know that I can’t take my chances with him anymore. I was lucky to get far away as it is.

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        2. Ann, I hope I didn’t come down too hard on you. I just want to protect you from any false hope. It was very strange when I was with James, we always had Christians around us somehow and miracles happened around us all the time. it was part of why i stayed with him as long as I did, because I felt God was working in our lives and sending people to James to save him. We had every religion try to save james, and they were dedicated God believing, walking the walk Christians. One pastor imparticular, moved from where James grew up to start a new church in the town James and I moved to only a few weeks earlier. He couldn’t find an office to rent on any other street but James Street in Mission. He called for a load of gravel for their new house, James was driving the gravel truck. When we moved to Mission the first thing James did was to volunteer us at the race track, he was burn out box director for the street legal races. Pastor Jim had a race car. James played guitar, pastor Jim’s church needed a guitar player.When we moved to Mission James had said things were going to be different, we were going to find our church home.
          James and pastor jim spent a lot of time together working on cars, at the track, Pastor Jim knew he was there to save James. i knew he was there to save James. Pastor Jim got him to go to couples counseling (once) When we were broke Pastor Jim cooked for us. When James got arrested pastor Jim picked us up from the cop shop.
          James would promise to attend church, I would go and Pastor Jim and his wife would be standing by the door and when Pastor Jim saw me walk in without James, his wife told me; he would start to cry.
          We left the town and a few months later the church dissolved and Pastor Jim and his wife left the town also.
          I moved to a trailer park 7 years later and thought I saw Pastor Jim’s race car drive past, and sure enough it was them living 5 doors down from me.
          He had not been a pastor since, he drove a bus now.
          I love him and his wife, very good people. But if he couldn’t get through to james I don’t know who could.
          James went to Africa to do missionary work and ended up stealing from the charity, getting a young Ugandan girl pregnant and getting run out of the country.
          So I have reason to believe there is a limit to even God’s powers.
          Believe me, I would like nothing better than to find a way that these people could be fixed, think of the heart ache that would prevent in the world.

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          1. I think GOD is All Powerful, however, the free-will thing is a hard and fast rule. As much as I pray for wisdom for my Narc, so that he can start doing the right things instead of the wrong ones, he has even said to me himself “I have Free- Will”. My N has also been arrested more than a few times. In a way, he seems to have a little Anti- social PD as well.

            Anyway, I pray for him from afar and thank GOD for delivering me from him.

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  6. I have been reading some of your posts and I didn’t know such human exists. But I am happy that things turned out well for you and turning your experience into positive. Glad that you pulled it through and I admire you for that. Great posts. – Ritter

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